Is this reason for liberals to be against religion valid?

You hit the nail on the head when you said the church is backward about gays in the eyes of the world. That’s because the world is carnal and devilish as in “worldly.” I would hope that the true Church would stand as a beacon to those who want to put off the natural man and come unto Christ. Those who are baptized covenant to be clean and pure from sin. When they stumble, there is a path to take for forgiveness by The Lord. The Lord also taught come unto Him “and sin no more.” Not it’s okay to continue to break his commandments. Not it’s okay to change his commandments to fit the worldly view or majority way of thinking. The Lords kingdom is not a democracy majority rules.

You are correct! We don’t know you either except by your words you put down in here too. You also realize that most have rejected your written thoughts too about gays and women in the priesthood.

The problem I see is that you have never stated your testimony of the Prophet Joseph Smith. You’ve never stated that you believe he was visited by the Father, Son, Holy Ghost and Angels to receive the Keys of the Kingdom and establish Christ’s Church. Nothing about the Book of Mormon being another Testament of Christ. Nothing about President Monson being a Prophet being the only one who receives revelation for not only the entire Church, but the rest of the world as well. And, that no Prophet will lead the Church astray from the path to Eternal Life for all to follow if they freely choose to do so.

We don’t really know much about you except that you lack a true testimony like Jim and I have. Am I wrong?

You might want to know that since being in a leadership position for the past 32 years in our ward, I’ve home taught mostly less actives, part member families including gays. One of those, who’s two brothers were gay, left the Church. Not because she didn’t have a testimony of the above I mentioned. But, because she was swayed by one of her brothers and her daughter, who both were anti-Mormon. I still see her and she is not angry with me nor the Church. She was simply distracted by the heavy mist leading her blindly away of the path to eternal life. The mist was people like yourself and Mike who believe the world has more light than the Prophet and Apostles.
As far as the others who I’ve been home teaching for years, we are friends and they trust me not to judge them. But, they also clearly know where I stand when it comes to the commandments and the Prophet’s voice. He and only he is the voice from The Lord.

What the heck Jim? What do you mean, “show your true colors?” You’re starting to sound as crazy as grasshopper. All I said was the church should be more accepting, especially of its own members and if I missed responding to something you said it wasn’t intentional. The way you treat KC is pretty disappointing. It sounds like you think there is no room for him in the church. Not very kind.

Is this board messed up or what? I think it’s showing that my words were Jim’s. Check again because I think you are responding to me, not Jim.
As far as KC is concerned, there are different levels of membership. There are those who have taken upon them great leadership and received much knowledge in the Temple. There are those that never got off the ground after baptism. Then, a vast number in the middle. KC has been in great leadership roles and to the Temple taking upon him non-worldly things. Yet, he’s leading astray many regardless of his seemingly smooth delivery of love and kindness. There is no love in leading people away from Christ regardless of the method. Satan got Eve to eat the fruit through seemingly kindness, understanding, logic and reasoning.

I treat KC just fine. He and I have an understanding and we’re both chill with it. He knows I would welcome him here anytime and I know the same about him.

And I said “your colors” because I thought you were moving beyond what you had defined yourself as acceptable. Comments like -

“Also, I have to say that the LDS church is pretty poorly positioned to condemn gay’s on the basis of ‘traditional marriage’”

The church is not condemning gays on any basis. They are supporting marriage between a man and woman. Mostly, I was kind of wondering why you don’t really respond to my comments and instead focus on disparaging my beliefs based on your perception of truth.

That was all.

Actually you will find that I am pretty easy going about stuff and while I agree with a lot of the things that Grasshopper says, I don’t always agree with how he says it. I’m a “message” as opposed to “messenger” person.

As far as KC goes, it’s like I said… we have an understanding called mutual respect. I believe that is something you and I could have as well, but it takes time to work it out.

Anybody got some popcorn? This show keeps going on and on and on and on… :wink: :smiley: LOL

1 Like

Jim,

Sorry if I offended you. I’m still not sure what I didn’t respond to or why you would get upset because I say the LDS church is condemning gays (I just meant as opposed to not accepting them.)

You should chime in now Russ so we can hear what you have to say. As for me, I think the show is over. I can’t seem to comment here without offending people and that’s not my intention.

Later,

    - Mike

We condemn the sin as we do with adulterers or any sin. But, we will work with sinners and hopefully bring them to desire to stop sinning. We all sin and members continue to support and help each other. But, the sin comes because God set a law and a commandment. Russ said he didn’t know were the scriptures said anything about homosexual behavior being a sin. I have him a long list in both old and New Testament.

Not sure I would add anything much that hasn’t already been said. Just would keep the ‘show going on’ :wink:

When did I say that?

Quick Russ, turn and run really fast in the opposite direction. The grasshopper is pulling you in… run! fast! :smile:

2 Likes

I just can’t respond here with anything meaningful. You didn’t “offend”, the LDS church is accepting of gays… that is about all I can say.

1 Like

You said there was just that one in Romans chapter 1 and none for lesbians. So, I gave you the one for Lesbians in Romans Chapter 1 and a whole other versus in the bible.

I didn’t chime in on this thread until about four hours ago, so how could I have said something where I never did? I’ll give you a hint as to who did… search for the word ‘Romans’ on this page and you’ll find the other person who did. :slight_smile:

You are correct. It was Ron and he never responded back. Or at least I don’t think he did. But, in not the only one having problems with the same thing. The string tread system was much easier to follow.

1 Like

Jim, this is hard for me to say but the sad thing is that this is recent. Those of us who have LGBT family and friends know that in some areas kids were asked not to come church unless they repented of their feelings. I witnessed direct harassment toward individuals by priesthood leaders. I was even told I had a lack of faith and needed to pray more and be more faithful when I questioned the tactics. Fast forward 15 years and now the church has created a more open and inviting environment. Now these same people chime in on how tolerant and loving they are and always have been. I doubt my experience was isolated.

I am sure there are those on this board who get offended by my honesty and would say I need to be more faithful and pray more and repent. You would be right, and at least I know we all in the same boat.

In OT times, they would simply be stoned to death. The Lord didn’t change the commandments against sexual type sins. He simply said only if you haven’t sinned cast the stones at sinners of great sin. What KC and others want is for homosexual acts no longer be sins. Not that we should treat people poorly who have sinned. But, without punishment, there is no sin or law. Without law, there is no God.
The question becomes when does the men holding the keys of judgment step in and say enough to a sinner?

I don’t know, maybe it is because I live here in California but I just have never witnessed or been a part of some of the stuff people say has happened to them.

Yes, there will ALWAYS be people in the church who make bad decisions, treat other members unkindly and misrepresent some of the church’s teachings. Yes, past history shows that sometimes ignorance and misunderstanding are at the forefront of behavior.

So does that ultimately make the church and its’ doctrine false?

I have heard it often that the general membership of the church is just a few steps behind the world as it moves increasingly toward wickedness and the time of the second coming. Why can’t people just choose to follow the prophet, the mouthpiece of the Lord on the earth?

Is it not true that the Savior loved everyone but was still compelled to condemn their sinful ways? Of course He did. That goes for every sinful act, not just the ones that seem to be obsessed by some of the posters here.

I can’t make up stuff that I haven’t experienced. I haven’t seen the gross intolerance of gays in the church that so many speak of. What more can I say?

Grasshopper, Jim, Mike, KC, et.al.

I have a request.

Please stick to football and stay away from the more personal topics of politics and religion. Stay away from personal attacks. (This is not being Christ Like).

All that post here are not currently LDS. Let’s be respectful of all on this site and stick to football.

No more degrading people with socialist talk. To some, being socialistic is being Christ Like in wanting to help the poor, (and the poor shall inherit the earth), Christ eating with the tax collectors; His life companion being a prostitute. (Let he without sin cast the first stone), etc. (I know, many do not believe this scripture to be correct) How do we pick and choose which we believe and which we believe to not be translated correctly.

No more Republican/Democratic/Tea Party/Libertarian or religious talk on this football section. Please. :Let’s all practice respect for each other. Thanks ron

1 Like

I didn’t start it on this section. By the way, I don’t believe the prostitute’s name was ever given. Was it? And, socialism is something a government of man forced upon its subjects or slaves. I don’t believe Christ has ever suggested that we should live in socialism and certainly not Communism. That makes it very difficult to be free to choose. I think the Prophet, President Benson, which we are studying this year would agree Jesus did not teach us to live under socialism.